Interesting study about air quality. What are your thoughts http://www.greenbuildingtalk.com/News/tabid/58/action/view/id/72227/Default.aspx Now Linda Kincaid at Green Building Elements points us to a new study (pdf here) from the California Environmental Protection Agency's Air Resources Board that finds that 67% of new homes do not meet the minimum California standard for air changes; it seems that nobody opens their windows or runs their kitchen exhaust fans enough to adequately ventilate their homes. And to nobody's surprise, "nearly all homes had formaldehyde concentrations that exceeded guidelines for cancer and chronic irritation, while 59 percent exceeded guidelines for acute irritation

Eco houses have a ventilation problem. If everything is sealed, the air quality is a matter of concern. I have seen some devises. But they are not ideal. It is a contradiction.

To guest and Samfove, "Green Building 101". When designing and building a new energy efficient home, or renovating an older one, utilize non-toxic interior products and finishes, and install a quality HRV or ERV system.

Some green "experts" (at least one i know) say you don't need an ERV unless you are Howard Hughes. I'm with Sipper, i installed an ERV and connected it to the bathrooms -- it runs for 20 minutes when someone uses the fan. I've also seen them hooked up incorrectly -- basically running all the time like an AON (sp?) unit in hotels and this will hurt your energy performance. Regards.

so I take it you are comfortable relying on a mechanical system for your health and safety.

P.S. Couldn't make it through the 426 pages though. However, i did notice that they actually baselined the outdoors which is absolutely imperative a valid test. I read about a study like this some time ago where the inside air wasn't good and the outside air was worse :)

guest, I'm not sure what you are asking exactly. Do i trust my car to get me from a to b? Yes (usually) ;) Do I think that building poorly is better so that I can get air infiltration without an ERV. No. Can I have air that is cleaner inside than outside by building better and by filtering my air and injecting fresh air using an ERV? Yes. Regards.

certainly not suggesting embracing stupid (building poorly) Just wondering why those countries, states, counties that are passing legislation to ban EPS and formaldehyde containing products do not just put mechanical aspiration in the to go box or cabinet (enclosed space) if such is so reliable one would trust it with the life of their sleeping children Why not just have Coleman coolers make prefab houses with an ERV

There is no impending legislation, to ban the use of EPS, In any type of new building projects in the U.S. The same goes for the OSB that is used as "skins" for the majority of SIPs that are manufactured in this country, as well as for exterior sheathing that is used for most conventionally framed homes, as well as for many other types of buildings. If you have a specific case, study, or other reference to the contrary, please post this information, and, I will guarantee you a response within a very short period of time.

whoops, my mistake. I read that California was banning formaldehyde containing products in cabinets and other enclosed spaces, I read that King County (seattle) had banned food packaging made with Eps--Same in Germany. The thought/question is that would this be a precursur to looking at the air quality in tight construction--what this reports focus was. I read this report on this site (one of the articles featured to the right of the forums)

one of several references to the growing movement From the April 27th L.A. Times http://articles.latimes.com/2007/apr/27/local/me-wood27 ban formaldehyde in the living environment

Chemical in wood restricted
The state air board agrees to limit the use of formaldehyde glues used in veneer and plywood. It has been shown to cause cancer.
April 27, 2007|Janet Wilson, Times Staff Writer
California air regulators Thursday unanimously passed the world's toughest controls on toxic formaldehyde in wood products widely used in kitchen cabinets, countertops and other construction.

Environmentalists, public health advocates, and manufacturers and distributors of formaldehyde-free wood cheered the news.


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Quality Wood VeneerUK's only veneer manufacturer over 70 species in stock relianceveneer.comAdvertisement

Formaldehyde, widely used as a glue in wood veneer, plywood and other construction materials, has been shown to cause throat cancer, respiratory ailments and other problems.

The Air Resources Board vote limiting formaldehyde levels in wood products, which came after hours of testimony from all sides, was "a tremendous victory" for those who work with wood products, said Harry Demarest, chief executive of Columbia Forest Inc. of Portland, Ore., the largest manufacturer of veneer that uses soybean glue rather than formaldehyde.

"Formaldehyde is bad. We don't want it in our homes, and we don't want it in our stores. It is not healthy, believe me," said Valerie Cavazos, who handles sales at California Panel & Veneer Co. in Cerritos. The independent distributor has switched almost entirely to formaldehyde-free wood products, at the request of school districts and other large customers seeking environmentally friendly products.

But there was fierce debate about how the regulations, scheduled to be phased in between 2010 and 2011, would affect consumer prices.

California Air Resources Board staff said their research found it could cost as much as $6 more for a wood panel, but that would add just $400 to the cost of a new $500,000 home, or less than 1%.

But other wood industry and construction trade groups testified that the stricter limits could cause prices on wood products to skyrocket, possibly bankrupting cabinetmakers and other small businesses across the state.

Domestic manufacturers in particular fretted that overseas manufacturers would issue fraudulent paperwork saying the material met the standards, giving them an unfair advantage over local producers who could be more readily inspected. Countered Demarest of Columbia Wood: "We think the industry will be able to comply with no additional costs. We sell our product for the exact same cost" as veneer containing formaldehyde.

Cavazos, who has worked at California Panel & Veneer for 21 years, said she had suffered headaches and burning eyes from formaldehyde fumes. She thought the new regulations were a fine idea.

Food Service Packaging Requirements

The City of Seattle is requiring all food service businesses to find packaging alternatives to throw-away food service containers, cups and other products in all food service businesses - restaurants, grocery stores, delis, coffee shops and institutional cafeterias. By July 1, 2010, all food service products designed for one-time-use must be replaced with one-time use products that are either compostable or recyclable.
This is about the ban on EPS in King County for use as food packaging. Seems there is offgassing in a closed environment--especially at elevated temperatures (like those found in a wall cavity or a attic or a burger box)


When does the ban take effect?
Phase one of the ordinance applied only to expanded polystyrene (EPS, sometimes called “Styrofoam”). The foam ban took effect January 1, 2009.

Phase two of the ordinance applies to all throw-away food packaging and service ware. The ban on disposables takes effect July 1, 2010.

Formaldehyde Ban set for 22 Sept 2007WEBWIRE – Wednesday, July 04, 2007
Contact InformationAlkesh Patel
CMR Risks
PEAM
+447769690088
holdings.hubert@googlemail.comAfter nearly 10 years of planning the day has now been set for the banning of formaldehyde/formalin within Europe. This ban on sales and marketing comes on the heel of a ban on phenol in 2006. This impending ban is on top of the REACH ban on its manufacture and the ban brought in by the French Government under its CMR program earlier this year.

Someone in Brussels with a sense of timing or indeed a sense of humour has set the date for the 22nd of September 2007. This date is by coincidence the product code for embalming and taxidermy PT22.

This ban means that anyone currently using formaldehyde based products for embalming will need to seek an alternative or risk prosecution.

Why is it so important to ban formaldehyde? I think you will amply find this answer by Googling cancer!

Tell me when you have had enough. It is so easy to get information, just google any of the key words, read, decide what is best for your babies and the health of your clients

As we know courtesy of FEMA's optimization experiments, Formaldehyde exposure is not a good thing. It gets worse; a new study links it to amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS), or Lou Gehrig's disease. As we know courtesy of the Environmental Protection Agency, energy efficiency is a good thing, which is why they promote Energy Star houses, which have effective insulation, high-performance windows and tight construction.

One would think that a standard coming from the EPA would care about health and air quality instead of energy (isn't that another department?) but no, they recommend tightly sealing houses to reduce air leakage, the biggest energy loser. A leaky old house might change the air once an hour; a tightly sealed house designed for Energy Star might be as little as 1/100 of an air change per hour.

What happens when you don't change the air enough? The concentration of toxic chemicals gets higher. Formaldehyde, as an example, found in particle board, MDF, (medium density fibreboard) fabrics, glues and paints, and most fiberglass insulation. (More info here)


Sources of Formaldehyde: Home purifier expert

Nowhere does the Environmental Protection Agency mention the environmental hazards of these chemicals in such a tight envelope. While it does recommend mechanical ventilation, it mentions the problems of mold and pollutants only in passing.

Big Steps in Building:

1) Make Energy Star houses healthy houses, not just energy efficient. The program is run by an agency that seems to have its priorities confused. "Protecting the environment through energy efficiency" is fine, but not at the cost of air quality and the health of occupants. The agency should make the Indoor Air Package compulsory and ban the use of products with formaldehyde or any other VOC where there is an alternative available in any house going for Energy Star certification.

2) Make the California standard for formaldehyde emissions national.

3) Aim for a complete ban of formaldehyde use in building products.

guest;

please get your facts straight about why King county is banning EPS it has nothing to do with offgassing.
They are concerned with the styro cups/food containers waste from school cafeterias going into land fills. The containers are not being recycled.

the facts are: after the mfg. process EPS does not off gas, it is one of the healthiest insulations out there.
Our EPS core panels and skins are used in homes and commercially approved by the USDA for use in food processing areas, they are also used for "clean" rooms. They do not promote mold/mildew growth.
There is not a safer product on the market

http://www.doi.gov/greening/buildings/insulation.pdf
I have looked into it. That is why I am the only one here putting on independant reports done by people who do not peddle the product.
Fact is, EPS offgasses very little---at room temperature.
Re-read the Seattle law (or read it as the case may be) It was noted that the problem is more acute when the temperature is elevated. Just because something does not melt until it reaches 170 degrees or so does not mean that NOTHING happens in temperatures approaching the melt point.
I have saved the really heavy duty facts for later so keep it coming so I can lead you into the trap. Besides, everytime you guys selling EPS defend a product that does not merit your loyalty you cause people to search for themselves. You gotta love it

A quote from your report:

"EPS. Expanded polystyrene (EPS) is the only common rigid foam boardstock insulation made with neither CFCs nor HCFCs. "

Lay it on us if ya got the heavy duty stuff!

you are a fanatic making claims based on 1/2 truths if the EPS is at 170 degrees you are already dead! and not from off gassing

You have not posted anything to refute that EPS is not a safe insulation

please show the proof for that statement!

”THis is not the "heavy stuff" just more interesting information. I agree that 70 degrees would be very uncomfortable--or very comfortable if you were dead and had lived a good life-- However, my point was not that it melts at that temperature--or close to it. My point is , as I said, just because that is where it melts does not mean that NOTHING happens in elevated temperatures approaching that. I do not know how to say it any plainer. ALL of the off gassing studies I have been able to find are condusted at ambient. Ambient is not the norm in the istalled condition. Calling me names for asking a pertinent question does not strengthen your "aurgument" The LD50 of styrene is 3 mmol/kg as determined by the Registry of Cytotoxicity Data (ZEBET) 7.1, National Institute of Health, Berlin, Germany. There are, of course, studies concerning polystyrene containers used for food packaging which find that styrene oligomers migrate into the food.[32]. For instance, one Japanese study conducted on wild-type and AhR-null mice found that the styrene trimer, which the authors detected in cooked polystyrene container-packed instant foods, may increase thyroid hormone levels.[33] Polystyrene is classified according to DIN4102 as a "B3" product, meaning highly flammable or "easily ignited." Consequently, although it is an efficient insulator at low temperatures, its use is prohibited in any exposed installations in building construction if the material is not flame retardant, e.g., with hexabromocyclododecane. It must be concealed behind drywall, sheet metal or concrete. Foamed polystyrene plastic materials have been accidentally ignited and caused huge fires and losses, for example at the Düsseldorf International Airport, the Channel tunnel (where polystyrene was inside a railcar that caught on fire), and the Browns Ferry Nuclear Power Plant (where fire breached a fire retardant and reached the foamed plastic underneath, inside a firestop that had not been tested and certified in accordance with the final installation). In addition to fire hazard, polystyrene can be dissolved by substances that contain acetone (such as most aerosol paint sprays), and by cyanoacrylate glues.