I am looking to build a new house using icf construction for the basement and upper two levels.  House is 60x40.  9ft ceillings on each leve.  Basement is walkout. What should I expect my rough cost to be here in Virginia?
I am looking for a contractor with experience.
thanks.

Hello browndawg,

Based on the information given, I can provide you with the following estimate...with a foot print of 200 linear feet and a wall height of 30' from top of the footer to sill plate (for the 9' ceilings), you will have about 6000 sqft of wall. Depending on the size of the block for the basement 6" or 8" you are looking a between $10.50 to $11.00 per sqft of wall (or between $63,000 and $66,000), perhaps slightly more for an 8" foundation wall, be we could probably work on that. That estimate would be a turnkey install (labor and all material) from top of the footer to the sill plate. Some of this would depend on where you are specifically located in Virginia (Wise, VA would certainly change things).

Based on location I may be able to provide additional information and break it down for you in more detail. I can provide you with several recommendations from owners, architects, and engineers as to the quality of the work. Call me 540-910-2904 or PM me if you have any additional questions.

Thanks,

Ren Angle

browndawg, remember all ICFs are not blocks, just for comparison purpose you might want to check with the guys at TF, the original "Vertical" system. I think that they have at least one distributor/installer in your area.

In any event, good luck with your project, whichever ICF system that you select.

Browndawg,

 There are many good ICFs on the market, but I there are many more questions that need to be answered.   Pricing of $10/sqft would be a very conservative estimate, but pump charges and freight to your job site may cause that to change.  I would be happy to disucss job specific details with you at your convience.

$10 wow where are you located?

We're Buckeyes! You know the killer nut(s). We can easily handle any job east of the Rockies. West of the Rockies...not saying no, just a little more trucking.

$10.50 to $11 sounds about right for here in upstate New York too.

BWerks, do you represent a specific form manufacturer at that price. I have a northern buckeye project i'm specing out myself presently.

BWerks has numerous products to offer, an open mind and the ability discuss different solutions is what some people regard as most valuable.

Optimal project performance and value is typically the result.

Your project seems overbid. I'm not understanding where the numbers often found on this site are coming from. Our goal is to offer ICF construction at reasonable, affordable, and profitable levels. Our cost on a project like this would be nearly twenty thousand dollars less, and we make a decent profit. Eight dollars a square foot is a fair number. Large windows may reduce the 5707 square foot price. Your first estimate was for an additional 197 sq ft since they used thirty feet for an elevation. I suspect you can be very close to your specifications with a twenty seven foot elevation. Even at thirty foot, including pump truck cost, and with no window or door deductions our estimate would be fifteen to eighteen thousand dollars less than your first estimate. It is disturbing to see ICF estimates so high. I believe it does a disservice to the potential for advancement of ICF construction. I sometimes wonder if it is possible that numbers come from a source that has an interest in keeping the numbers high in comparison to other building methods. I don't know that, I just sometimes wonder. I would suggest looking for more estimates.

HansConst...I am intrigued no how you can so easily state that the project is overbid? The project is near the Blue Ridge Mountains in Virginia, but with no additional information. Depending on where they are located, concrete can get pretty expensive because areas are very remote. In addition, I realize that youdistibute a waffle grid ICF system, but if backfill is substantail, are you comfortable building the foundation with a waffle grid ICF form? Are you certain that the building officials there wil sign off on having such a foundation? The engineers that I work with in Virginia dont' believe that they will.

Also, are you located near this particular job or in some other geographic region of the US? If in another region, are you willing to travel 500 miles or so to do an ICF project for $6.80 to 7.64sqft? That is a price you quoted that you normally get for a turnkey product.

If they person in question wants 9' ceiling in the house, I would really like to know how you can get that done with a 27' elevation as you stated....is there a new flooring system out there that is 1" thick?

I find it disturbing that you come out making these remarks about ICFs without at least saying that you are a distibuter for a waffle grid system. I am not going to use this as platform to harp on waffle grid, however I would never use them below grade.

First, my apology for a mistake. 'Twenty seven feet' was typed when it should have been twenty nine feet (three elevations at nine foot plus two floors at one foot). The rest of the post, despite the attempt to discredit it, requires no apology in so far as can be seen. I have made but few posts on this site, and most are in regard to what it should cost to build with ICFs. When other authors begin to justify their higher prices then I believe it will benefit the ICF industry. Until that time we do a disservice to our readers with our attempts to justify our pricing simply by attacking other posts. Here's a reply to one posters concerns or attacks, as you will. An attempt will be made to keep the reply reasonable and polite. The post asks about whether location matters since concrete can get pretty expensive. The answer is no, not much if any. Up charges on concrete for as much as 20% on this project would add maybe $700 at the high end. No huge surprise or cost here since we often do 'remote', as in a hundred miles from a plant. The post asks if I am "certain that the building officials will sign off". No, I'm not certain of much, but I try to be somewhat confident in my understanding of the International Residential Code. The code specifies how ICFs are to be built, reinforced, poured, and waterproofed along with numerous other requirements, and approves the use of ICFs in nearly every art of the country. Maybe they don't use code in the mountains of Virginia, I'm not certain. But neither would I be overly concerned about what the engineers that work with this poster believe. In the end, the post seems fixated on the style of ICF used. Actually, we don't use a 'waffle grid system'. We use several systems; a screen grid of 6" or 8" and a solid system of 4" to 24". Either brand of ICF will handle more than this project entails. The project has a daylight basement which means the highest level of backfill is not likely more than eight feet. Not a problem according to the requirements of the International Residential Code. We have in fact successfully installed engineered screen grid walls below grade over twenty feet. The walls were unsupported by any intermediary floor, and they are specified for D1 seismic. Those are the engineers that we work with! The cost posted at about sixteen to twenty thousand dollars less was indeed for the screen grid ICF since it will pass code and provide a safe and secure home for the owner. When a customer wants a solid style ICF, or the project warrants it, then there is about three thousand additional in concrete expense. Still this is not much of a dent in the sixteen to twenty thousand dollar differential. Our price is still fair, valid, and profitable throughout the country! The last bit of opinion expressed seems to sum up the tone of opposition to competition that runs throughout the gentleman's post. Quote: "I am not going . . . to harp on waffle grid, however I would never use them below grade." Please, go ahead and harp, but make it responsible harping through the use of fact with citations. At present, all styles of ICF are approved by the International Residential Code. There are also similar use restrictions on each style, however opinion alone does not mitigate the fact that all styles of ICF have been successfully used in the same situation as the poster and his engineers believe they can't be used in. We might remember, as we go forward, the words of Daniel Moynihan, "Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts".

Ren's right. The going rate for residential ICF here in Central VA is about $11 per wall square foot. A little more for commercial.

HanConst,

The reason for the "attack" which I don't believe that it is, is because of your statement that "It is disturbing to see ICF estimates so high. I believe it does a disservice to the potential for advancement of ICF construction" I have tried very hard to be very fair and honest on this blog/board whatever you wish to call it, because I believe that doing so wrong to many on here that may not have that much information regarding ICF construction. I also like the mentioning that perhaps we don't have building codes here...classy.

I (and at least two others on this thread) believe that $10.50 - $11.00 a sqft for a turnkey price, depending of course on the complexity of design. Now if we can get a lot of people to agree to your position, I will be shocked. Heck Bruce Polycrete and I are both in Virginia, so I would hope that we know since the initial post was for a house in Virginia. For the most part forms cost about the same, as does rebar, and possibly concrete as well. Labor can be argued in certain circumstance (as it is a variable depending on over head etc.), then the other variable becomes concrete, as a grid system may not require as much. If people feel comfortable with a grid system great, I feel more comfortable with a conventional monolithic ICF wall system.

I will continue to agree with smartwall and bruce at polycrete and move on.

Relative to the question of cost.  Would the same $10.50 to $11.00 per square foot apply to a single 9 foot daylight basement?  Also what ballpark addtional cost is associated with footings of say 24" wide by 8" high?

Thanks
Jay

Yes, that cost would remain there, probably $11.00 due to increases in rebar and forms. I would say if the design is not complicated, the structure can handle 6" ICF walls, then you could hit that, if 8" ICF walls a bit more to accommodate the concrete. Footing would be $13 a linear foot for dug footers, a little more for form a drain.

I can't believe that I am getting sucked into this same old argument, but here goes. ICF cost $46.00 for an 8" block 12 square feet. works out to $3.83 per square. Concrete price for 25mpa ICF mix $130 per metre. works out to $2.45 per square. niether price includes tax and we are already at $6.28 per square foot. Now I am in Ontario where tax is 13%, now we are at $7.09 per square. That only includes 2 items needed for a supply/install job. I realize that with openings there can be some deductions made but come on, how can one supply/install for $8 a square. Unless the quote comes with a catch, owner supplies concrete, pump etc. I can't see how it is possible. I am surprised you guys can install turn key for $11. but if you are still making money, good for you. I would be curious to see a break down of costs for $8/square but unfortunately most are unwilling to 'show their work'.
Paul Stevens

PS It feels good to be back!

Based on my costs here in Arkansas, I'm looking at ~$6/sq ft of wall area for the materials to build my ICF basement walls. 192 linear ft @ 10' tall. LiteForm Xtra ICF with 8" core. 4000 psi concrete (~$100/yd). GR 60 #4 rebar @ 16" oc horizontal and #5 @ 16" oc vertical on 3 walls and the walkout side will be #4 @ 16" oc vertical. Pumper truck is ~$400 for half day.

arkie6, you are getting off easy with the pump. Mine is a minimum of 4 hours plus 2 hours travel time. Thats 6 hours at $150 per hour. By the way those concrete prices just went down to $130/metre. In the winter we have to pay for winter heat, (hot water) at another $12 per metre. With all that is involved in an ICF job to be done properly, I just don't see how you can include the ICF, concrete, rebar, pump truck, bracing, labour, misc., window/door buck material, workers comp. and insurance, taxes, etc all for $8 a square and that still doesn't include water proofing, footings weeping tile stone. I had a chance to pick up a set of Ping Rapture golf clubs the other week for $600, now for those who don't know the Ping Rapture are probably the best irons on the market right now retailing at around $1300, looked to good to be true for that price, so I took them to the retail store and guess what, they were fake. Like the old saying goes "if it looks to good to be true, it probably is". Now with that said, maybe Hans Cons can really supply install for about $8 a square, I don't know. But I would love to see the prices of the ICF and material he installs, what is the name brand? If the prices are that great I am going to install it too because at those prices I would get all the ICF work for miles around!!

Paul Stevens

Fortunately for me, the concrete pumper truck guy lives ~5 miles down the road. He charges a 4 hr minimum @ $100/hr in the morning, but only 2 hour minimum after noon. I was planning on doing the wall pour after noon since there is really not much finish work required. He pumped my footings (20 yds) in the afternoon in <2 hours and it cost ~ $300. Also, the concrete mix plant is ~10 miles away which also saves on transportation costs.

Note that my cost estimate didn't include bracing (I'm building it myself with lumber that will be used inside the house when done) or waterproofing on the below grade portions of the walls.